Tigers fire coach Chuck Hernandez

Tigers fire coach Chuck Hernandez

The Tigers have decided to fire pitching coach Chuck Hernandez and bullpen coach Jeff Jones, the team announced after today's game.
Advertisement

Detroit manager Jim Leyland said prior to this afternoon’s game that the team was not ready to make any announcement related to its coaching staff, but club officials have indicated for several days that general changes were imminent. The dismissals of Hernandez and Jones are the first of them.

As recently as Friday afternoon, Hernandez said in an interview that he had not been told of his status for 2009 – an ominous sign. The team entered today’s game with a 4.87 ERA, the third-worst in the American League.

Hernandez, 47, has been with the team for three seasons and has one year remaining on his contract. He was in uniform and in the dugout for today’s home finale against the Tampa Bay Rays.

Dontrelle Willis’ season-long control problems created a major disruption to the pitching staff and were certainly a factor in Hernandez’s dismissal. Willis went 0-2 with a 9.38 ERA and pitched only 24 innings after signing a three-year, $29-million contract.

Willis’ best season came in 2005, when he won 22 games for the Florida Marlins. His pitching coach that year was Mark Wiley, who held the same role on the Cleveland teams that reached two World Series in the 1990s.

The Tigers may wish to consider the 60-year-old Wiley for the position, because of his past success and ties to Willis. However, Wiley is under contract with the Marlins through next season, and an industry official told the Free Press that Florida would not likely grant Detroit permission to interview him.

Aww I'm gunna miss Jeff J.

oh yeah...

Tigers coaches Hernandez and Jones fired
by Steve Kornacki
Sunday September 28, 2008, 5:54 PM

DETROIT -- Tigers pitching coach Chuck Hernandez and bullpen coach Jeff Jones both will be relieved of their duties after Monday's game in Chicago with the White Sox.

"It's just one of those unfortunate things," Detroit manager Jim Leyland said, "but you know somebody's going to pay. Next year, it will be me."

The Tigers are in last place in the Central Division at 74-87, and the pitching staff's 4.88 ERA is 12th in the American League.

"I feel very bad for those guys," Leyland said. "They are both very good and it just didn't work out."

Hernandez and Jones requested not to be interviewed Sunday after the news was released.

"I feel bad, too, because I feel it's partially my fault," said staff ace Justin Verlander, who was 11-17 with a 4.84 ERA. "I was one of the guys on the staff who didn't pitch their best. And the ax fell on (Hernandez), fairly or unfairly."

Leyland said Jones, 52, who had been the pitching coach for the Toledo Mud Hens before getting hired by the Tigers Nov. 9, 2006, likely will get another job in the organization. Hernandez, 47, was the pitching coach for the 2006 World Series team and also has been the pitching coach for the Tampa Bay Rays and Los Angeles Angels.

Leyland said he will be allowed to pick the new coaches, while general manager Dave Dombrowski has veto power.

Asked for the qualities a new pitching coach should have to deal with the current staff, Leyland said, "At least (being) one of the apostles."

Brandon Inge, a catcher most of the season, took the news hard.

"We will miss both of them a lot," Inge said. "Today is one of the more frustrating days I've been a part of. Jeff Jones and Chuck Hernandez were two of the guys who helped me out all year and kept me sane.

"It drives me nuts that two guys who don't deserve to get fired did."

Leyland is under contract for next year, but wants a one-year extension.

"And I know my situation already," Leyland said.

Dombrowski will make an announcement on Leyland's contract if it is extended.

Dang. Its one of those things that you wanted to happen but when it did you were sad.

Jonesy for pitching coach!

Who did Trammel have as pitching coach?

GoGetEmTigers wrote:

Who did Trammel have as pitching coach?

Bob "old man" Cluck.

I hope nothing happens to Pickens now. *is worried*

gdennis59 wrote:

Dang. Its one of those things that you wanted to happen but when it did you were sad.

Jonesy for pitching coach!

I am not


Hernandez Sucks!


I would be if Todd Jones is the new coach;



Let Jones be new pitching coach!

bobrob2004 wrote:

Bring in Leo Mazzone!

Bring in Leo Mazzone!

Oh wait, someone already said that. No sense saying something stupid just so I don't copy what someone else said - we'll take Mazzone

gs78 wrote:

Let Jones be new pitching coach!

:puke2:

In fairness to Jones, I wouldn't want Rogers to be the coach either. Not only do neither of them have any experience at all as a pitching coach, neither of them are HOF-worthy pitchers.

catbox_9 wrote:

gs78 wrote:

Let Jones be new pitching coach!

:puke2:

In fairness to Jones, I wouldn't want Rogers to be the coach either. Not only do neither of them have any experience at all as a pitching coach, neither of them are HOF-worthy pitchers.

Jones is the greatest relief pitcher in Tigers History


He has done a lot more on the field than most Pitching coaches did in their careers

gs78 wrote:

Jones is the greatest relief pitcher in Tigers History

Because there's SO many great ones to choose from, right?

gs78 wrote:

He has done a lot more on the field than most Pitching coaches did in their careers

While true, being good at something doesn't make you a great teacher. Think back to the better teachers you had in school - they probably didn't go to Harvard. Being good at something is not a requirement to teaching something.

catbox_9 wrote:

gs78 wrote:

Jones is the greatest relief pitcher in Tigers History

Because there's SO many great ones to choose from, right?

gs78 wrote:

He has done a lot more on the field than most Pitching coaches did in their careers

While true, being good at something doesn't make you a great teacher. Think back to the better teachers you had in school - they probably didn't go to Harvard. Being good at something is not a requirement to teaching something.

Willie Hernandez was awesome in1984

Henneman had a few decent years; John Hiller had a decent career as a relief pitcher

Hernandez didn't do a ton other than 1984. Todd Jones never had a season even close to Hernandez's 1984.

You used the word decent to describe the other 2. That's enough said.

catbox_9 wrote:

Hernandez didn't do a ton other than 1984. Todd Jones never had a season even close to Hernandez's 1984.

You used the word decent to describe the other 2. That's enough said.

Jones had 42 saves in 2000

More than Hernandez in 1984


Jones Rules!

Jones was one of the most underrated relief pitchers in MLB


Just like K-Rod is the most overrated

Jones, 2000....
2-4 with a 3.52 ERA (4.68 league ERA....133 ERA+)
64 IP
1.438 WHIP
1 out saves: 5
3 out saves: 35
4 out saves: 2
Total saves: 42
Blown Saves: 4
Save %: 91.3%

Hernandez, 1984....
9-3 with a 1.92 ERA (3.92 league ERA.....204 ERA+)
140.3 IP
0.941 WHIP
1 out saves: 2
2 out saves: 3
3 out saves: 6
4 out saves: 1
5 out saves: 2
6 out saves: 10
7 out saves: 2
9 out saves: 5
12 out saves: 1
Total saves: 32
Hernandez didn't record his first save of 3 or fewer outs until 7/19, the team's 65th game of the year
Blown Saves: 1*
Save %: 97.0%
Cy Young Award
AL MVP


To suggest that these two were even reasonably close, is asinine.

------------------

*While Hernandez did technically blow one save in 1984 (in the 160th game of the season - his last attempt that regular season), it is hardly his fault. His line:
0.2 IP, 0H, 0BB, 0R, BS
For some reason, Sparky Anderson decided to bring Hernandez in to pitch in the 8th inning of a meaningless game to protect a 2-1 lead. The Yankees had runners on the corners and just one out making a save nearly impossible and thus ruining Hernandez's perfect season. The first batter hit a weak fly ball to RF and the runner on third scored (run charged to Aurelio Lopez) and Hernandez therefore blew the save. The next batter would also hit a routine fly ball.

Jones had a better career, though



Plus Hernandez played on the 84 Tigers

2000 Tigers were a lot worse

I really think Jonesy should be the bullpen coach, he did very well throughout his tremednous career, and really would be a good coach I think. Of course Im biased, but dont complain Cat, you would totally say the same for Lincecum.

gdennis59 wrote:

I really think Jonesy should be the bullpen coach, he did very well throughout his tremednous career, and really would be a good coach I think. Of course Im biased, but dont complain Cat, you would totally say the same for Lincecum.

No, Lincecum would be a horrendous choice for pitching coach of the Giants even if he blew his arm out tomorrow and could never pitch again. Not saying he could never be a pitching coach, but he has no experience doing it and MLB is not a good place to learn.

catbox_9 wrote:

gdennis59 wrote:

I really think Jonesy should be the bullpen coach, he did very well throughout his tremednous career, and really would be a good coach I think. Of course Im biased, but dont complain Cat, you would totally say the same for Lincecum.

No, Lincecum would be a horrendous choice for pitching coach of the Giants even if he blew his arm out tomorrow and could never pitch again. Not saying he could never be a pitching coach, but he has no experience doing it and MLB is not a good place to learn.

Example: Alan Trammell.

Actually Trammell or Gibson would now make good managers....

GoGetEmTigers wrote:

Actually Trammell or Gibson would now make good managers....

I respectfully disagree.

catbox_9 wrote:

gdennis59 wrote:

I really think Jonesy should be the bullpen coach, he did very well throughout his tremednous career, and really would be a good coach I think. Of course Im biased, but dont complain Cat, you would totally say the same for Lincecum.

No, Lincecum would be a horrendous choice for pitching coach of the Giants even if he blew his arm out tomorrow and could never pitch again. Not saying he could never be a pitching coach, but he has no experience doing it and MLB is not a good place to learn.

Like having previous experience did wonders for Chuck Hernandez

He'd probably have been even worse without experience. It would be asinine to hire a guy like Todd Jones as pitching coach when someone like Leo Mazzone is available.

catbox_9 wrote:

He'd probably have been even worse without experience. It would be asinine to hire a guy like Todd Jones as pitching coach when someone like Leo Mazzone is available.

If Mazzone is so great; How come the Orioles let him go after he failed in Baltimore.


Yeah! he was in Atlanta for many years;

And he also had Glavine, Smoltz and Maddux also

Those guys would have been stars even with Chuck Hernandez as their coach

Under Mazzone in Baltimore Erik Bedard became a very successful pitcher (not so much without him) as did Adam Loewen Daniel Cabrera.

Also, look at how some of those guys in Atlanta fared after they left Atlanta....Russ Ortiz, Denny Neagle, and Jaret Wright for example were pretty good in Atlanta but significantly worse after leaving.

Another tidbit....

In his book The Baseball Economist, J.C. Bradbury titles a chapter, "How Good is Leo Mazzone?" Using statistical analysis, he analyzes whether Mazzone had a significant impact upon the pitchers that he coached. The sample is all pitchers who have pitched at least one year under Mazzone and one year under a different pitching coach. Bradbury found that Mazzone lowered the ERA of pitchers by an average of .64 points, and that after leaving Mazzone, pitchers' ERA increased by an average of .78 points.

catbox_9 wrote:

Under Mazzone in Baltimore Erik Bedard became a very successful pitcher (not so much without him) as did Adam Loewen Daniel Cabrera.

Also, look at how some of those guys in Atlanta fared after they left Atlanta....Russ Ortiz, Denny Neagle, and Jaret Wright for example were pretty good in Atlanta but significantly worse after leaving.

That is true


But you could also say that became successful under Hernandez