GDT - Tigers @ Indians 7/4/05 (Game 1)

This is game one of a doubleheader on 7/4/2005. The original (which contains both games) can be found here.

From: tigerfanfromchicago 7/4/2005 1:09 pm
To: ALL (1 of 44)
15817.1
Let's get over .500. If we win both, we will be half way there.

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From: tigerfanfromchicago 7/4/2005 1:28 pm
To: ALL (2 of 44)
15817.2 in reply to 15817.1

Crisp triples, Hafner gets a RBI single.

1-0 CLE

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From: crackedoar 7/4/2005 1:49 pm
To: tigerfanfromchicago (3 of 44)
15817.3 in reply to 15817.1

I have some land in the swamps of flordia i want you to buy.

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 1:54 pm
To: ALL (4 of 44)
15817.4 in reply to 15817.3
Elarton 31 pitches through 3 innings. Man we are making his life really easy right now. Someone make him throw more than 3 pitches please.

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 1:58 pm
To: ALL (5 of 44)
15817.5 in reply to 15817.4

Question folks. Who calls a better game: Pudge or Wilson?

I ask this because are we giving Verlander the best opportunity to succeed with Wilson catching? After all J.J going in game 1 is a seasoned veteran and can handle himself out there regardless of the quality of the catcher calling the game.

do we owe it to Verlander to give him the best opportunity to do his best, and are we doing that with Wilson catching him?

Edited 7/4/2005 1:59 pm ET by fraquar

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From: mazman23 7/4/2005 2:00 pm
To: fraquar (6 of 44)
15817.6 in reply to 15817.5
Why isn't Polanco in the line up?

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 2:01 pm
To: mazman23 (7 of 44)
15817.7 in reply to 15817.6
Saving him for game two I guess. I suspect they may rest Inge in game two.

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From: bballdogg 7/4/2005 2:02 pm
To: tigerfanfromchicago (8 of 44)
15817.8 in reply to 15817.1
Not gonna happen...this one's already over, 3-0 Tribe in the bottom of the third. And it doesn't matter how well Verlander pitches tonight, because the Tigers can't score any runs to help him.

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 2:03 pm
To: bballdogg (9 of 44)
15817.9 in reply to 15817.8
You reckon that any Tiger staff member is taking notes on Belliards Sac Fly?

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 2:24 pm
To: ALL (10 of 44)
15817.10 in reply to 15817.9
Another starter with a near 5.00 ERA we are making look like Jim Bunning. 7-0 Tribe bottom of the 4th.
Edited 7/4/2005 2:26 pm ET by fraquar

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From: illinoitigerfan 7/4/2005 2:30 pm
To: fraquar (11 of 44)
15817.11 in reply to 15817.10
18 innings without scoring. Come on!

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From: tigerfanfromchicago 7/4/2005 2:34 pm
To: ALL (12 of 44)
15817.12 in reply to 15817.9

7-0 CLE

Remember, in the majority of double headers, the loser in game 1 is the winner in game 2.

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From: bballdogg 7/4/2005 2:36 pm
To: tigerfanfromchicago (13 of 44)
15817.13 in reply to 15817.12

says who?

And anyway, even if you're right, what makes you think this sorry bunch can beat the Indians?

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 2:40 pm
To: tigerfanfromchicago (14 of 44)
15817.14 in reply to 15817.12

The sad thing is I think the Indians may smell blood in the water. If they can sweep the Tigers they will bury us 10Gb of them in the standings, and possibly as much as 20GB of the 'Sox.

It would be nice if this team realized this is a time for a serious sense of urgency.

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From: illinoitigerfan 7/4/2005 2:41 pm
To: bballdogg (15 of 44)
15817.15 in reply to 15817.13
This puts a lot of extra pressure on Verlander that he does not deserve. He has to pitch a shut-out and hope the hitters accidentally push a run across?

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From: tigerfanfromchicago 7/4/2005 2:41 pm
To: bballdogg (16 of 44)
15817.16 in reply to 15817.13
I'm not sure where I first heard it, probably from Dan and Jim on WXYT during a different double header.

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 2:53 pm
To: ALL (17 of 44)
15817.17 in reply to 15817.16
Isn't it time to make some heads roll? We came into this season with the firm expectation of having one of the most solid hitting teams in the American League. And here we are at the halfway point. And we might very well have the worst hitting team in baseball. Isn't it time to start demoting some people--starting with DY, Monroe, Logan, etc.? Isn't it time to question whether Alan Trammel is a competent enough manager? Isn't it time to bring up some young players to see what they can do? Really, can they do any worse than this inept crew? I don't know what is wrong with this team that cannot seem to hit pitchers with ERA's at 5.00 or more. To say they are lousy is actually speaking too well of them.

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From: illinoitigerfan 7/4/2005 2:55 pm
To: tigerfanfromchicago unread (18 of 44)
15817.18 in reply to 15817.16
Scott Elarton a 1-hitter? Was he chosen to be on the all-star team? 20 innings without scoring a run?

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From: bballdogg 7/4/2005 2:59 pm
To: illinoitigerfan (19 of 44)
15817.19 in reply to 15817.18
they're not even trying anymore!

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 3:00 pm
To: shibboleth (20 of 44)
15817.20 in reply to 15817.17

After this week we will effectively be out of any realistic hope of playing anything but spoiler in August and September. This club has way too many deficiencies in their fundamental game to overcome the gap we would have to make up after the All-Star break.

We will be sellers, not buyers at the trade deadline. We shouldn't expect to get much for what we have to sell though - after all, what we have to sell is a major part of the problem with this offenses' ability to produce on a consistent basis..

From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 3:03 pm
To: fraquar (21 of 44)
15817.21 in reply to 15817.20
I honestly think that all Detroit fans should seriously consider boycotting this team. Why should we spend any money on this piece of trash?

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 3:09 pm
To: shibboleth (22 of 44)
15817.22 in reply to 15817.21
Pudge grounds into another freakin double play. He's going the the All-Star game? He's one of the least deserving on this team.

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 3:10 pm
To: shibboleth (23 of 44)
15817.23 in reply to 15817.22
Never put a bat into Pudge's hands when there are runners in scoring position. He'll screw it up for sure.

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 3:12 pm
To: shibboleth (24 of 44)
15817.24 in reply to 15817.23
There has never been a Tiger team that I loved so much at the beginning of the season; and that I detested so much by mid-season.

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From: illinoitigerfan 7/4/2005 3:13 pm
To: shibboleth (25 of 44)
15817.25 in reply to 15817.23
I am having a hard time believing that the weight loss was beneficial to Pudge's hitting. I hate to say it, but was steroids involved?

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From: illinoitigerfan 7/4/2005 3:16 pm
To: shibboleth (26 of 44)
15817.26 in reply to 15817.24
You are right. I don't know when I have been so disappointed in a team expected to do better than last year. I was not even predicting a play-off appearance. Just continued improvement over last year, maybe 82-80.

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 3:23 pm
To: illinoitigerfan (27 of 44)
15817.27 in reply to 15817.26
Then the Indians come to bat...Spurling gets the first two out with ease...then he starts screwing up. Of course, Carlos Guillen helped him out by flinging an impossible throw about 10 feet over Shelton's head. As terrific as Guillen was last year--he's another player that seems to have regressed. He never made silly mistakes like he's making now.

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 3:28 pm
To: shibboleth (28 of 44)
15817.28 in reply to 15817.27
I think that DY should be released, Monroe either benched or sent down to the minors, and Logan also sent down until he shows that he can consistently hit breaking balls and add some strength to his frame. I think Thames should be brought back up (he's tearing it up in Toledo) because I do not believe has been given a chance to play on a consistent basis. Maybe such a move would work and maybe not. But it cannot be worse than what we have which clearly is not working at all.

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From: ttownjotes 7/4/2005 4:21 pm
To: illinoitigerfan (29 of 44)
15817.29 in reply to 15817.26

>You are right. I don't know when I have been so disappointed in a team expected to do better than last year.

It doesn't help when you see almost every ground ball that JJ served up (which is what you want from a pitcher of his type) somehow find a hole in the infield. I've never seen a team do that as much as the Indians.

Those breaks turned what probably should have been maybe a 4-3 loss (giving Hafner his due, he earned his RBI's) into a 9-3 stinker.

Some days I feel fortunate I don't throw a brick through my TV, it's that frustrating to watch. Guess it's good I live here and see a "neutral" team like the Orioles most days.

::: takes deep breath and counts backwards from 10 ::: Ok...hope the bad breaks are out of the way, let's get the split and take the next two as well. This was one game of four.

tt

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 5:26 pm
To: ttownjotes (30 of 44)
15817.30 in reply to 15817.29
Well, what disturbs me the most is not that the Indians scored 9 runs. Even good pitchers have bad days (e.g., Bondo giving up 9 runs in 2 innings) and sometimes a series of poor outings (Randy Johnson). But what possible excuse can the hitters on this team have for being so anemic for so long (it's been two months of terrible hitting)? Having only 1 hit through 6 innings against a pitcher with a 4.99 ERA has become an all-too-familiar refrain. I've never seen a team consistently hit so badly against bad pitchers. That is what really pi$$e$ me off the most.

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From: fraquar 7/4/2005 5:34 pm
To: shibboleth (31 of 44)
15817.31 in reply to 15817.30

If we get swept by the Indians it's curtains for the 2005 Tigers. No way even Superman could chase down AT LEAST two of three team who would be leading them by 10 games+ each, and that wouldn't even guarantee them a Wild Card spot.

Like I said earlier, I think the Indians smell blood in the water, and they will be gunning to eliminate us from contention.

I'll see you this offseason for another chapter in "Next Year is our Year" - in the meantime I'll begin my Lions watch. Peace and have a good summer.

Edited 7/4/2005 5:37 pm ET by fraquar

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From: shibboleth 7/4/2005 5:43 pm
To: fraquar (32 of 44)
15817.32 in reply to 15817.31
No doubt about it that it will be lights out for the 2005 Tigers, if it isn't already. What kills me is that the seasoned veterans on this team are the big let downs, not the younger players. However, I do think Logan needs to be sent down until he can learn to hit breaking pitches and Craig Monroe either benched or send down as well.